Following up on my post from last week, here’s an update:
“A man on the run from police since his teenage daughters were found shot to death in a taxicab on New Year’s Day had threatened to hurt one of the girls for dating a non-Muslim boy, according to police documents.“
So, a Muslim man killed his own daughters for liking boys not of the “correct” religion… hmmm… That sure sounds like an honor killing to me.
21 Comments
Comments RSS TrackBack Identifier URI
Leave a comment
And you may want to read this http://salaamsblog.wordpress.com/2008/01/08/honor-killing-in-texas/
An American muslim who claims honor killings are expressly forbidden in Islam… (I think he’s right)
“Shirhashirim,” that certainly didn’t stop an Egyptian Muslim from carrying one out in Texas though. The true teaching of Islam, whatever that may be, is irrelevant. The practice is what matters. I don’t know why you insist on standing up for a religion that practices such hatred. Yaser Abdel Said, like so many Muslims throughout the world, believed he was justified in killing his own daughters for violating the teachings of the Koran. It’s sickening and you should comdemn his religiously-motivated actions.
And why would it? People have been commiting atrocities regardless of whatever bans or eternal punishments religions (and other ideologies) have tried to put on them. Of course Islam is not going to stop an idiot from being one, how could it?
I’m not standing up for a religion that practices such hatred. As you say: ‘The true teaching of islam (…) is irrelevant”. Religions don’t practice anything, people do. So stick to people.
Motivation matters, though… even legally. Ever hear of 1st, 2nd, or 3rd degree murder? This man’s adherence to a perverse religion (regardless of the religion’s actual intent) led him to commit pre-meditated, first-degree murder. That’s significant, and I pray not the beginning of a trend in America.
So what about the gazillion of honor killings that happen with people that practice the Hindu religion, various Asian religions, African Animist religions, and there was a big one this summer in Northern Iraq where a girl was stoned and it was captured on a camera phone, and they weren’t Muslim either.
When the ignorant accept the fact(s) that honor killings is a cultural phenomenon and not a religious one, then people wouldn’t be so quick to try and link Islam with this. But of course anything a Muslim does if it helps the agenda, it must be Islamic.
I will be sure to highlight the next time a criminal does something and claims he is a Christian that it was a Christian teaching.
The girls had a Christian service and a Muslim Service. The mother is a Christian. The dad doesn’t seem too much of a Muslim to have a Christian wife so why are we calling this a “Muslim Honor Killing”. All of the Islamophobes rolling out of the rocks they hide beneath, eh?
Robert,
A Christian father tossed 4 of his kids off the bridge in Arkansas. Another Christian father burnt his wife and 4 kids in Cincinnati this Friday. Seems like a case of “Christian Honor Killings” to me. Don’t you agree? Be sure to post about these cases of “Christian Honor Killings” everywhere you post. I will be sure to do that.
AJ, if the father threw his children off of a bridge because they didn’t adhere to biblical teaching, then maybe you’d have a valid comparison. Yaser Abdel Said killed his daughters because they didn’t adhere to Islam. You’re comparing apples to oranges. Besides, I sincerely doubt that the man who tossed those kids off of a bridge is a Christian. Even if he attended church somewhere occasionally, which I doubt, that does not a Christian make. Stop defending Said and his actions, which by definition, were an Islamic honor killing.
AJ, JLG is devoid of reason. His mouth or is this case his fingers, bear witness to his heart. Of course, in this 75% Christian country, there is no way anyone who commits a crime is actually a Christian, that’s impossible, because all Christians are good people. Only when Muslims do something is it always because of Islam.
When the zodiac killer committed mass murder, did we blame all dogs when he reported that his dog sam told him to do it? Absolutely not, but let someone claim they are doing something for Islam, then it must be true.
When the Westboro Baptist Church was harassing vets funerals in the name of Jesus (as), we were automatically told they are not real Christians. But let Muslims do something, and non-Muslims have the power to let us Muslims know what is or is not Islamic.
The truth is whether you kill your kids because your crazy or you kill because you claim your religion tells you too, only when it’s Muslims involved, will Islam always be the blame.
Racism in America is the same as it was less than 50 years ago when my parents as children had to buy candy in the back alley, because they weren’t allowed in the front.
The difference is, racists have just found another target. Before 9/11 you never heard anything about Islam even though OBL attacked Kenya and the US Cole, but now that predominantly white politicians and “Christians” have found a niche’ market, let the hate flow….
When Muslims get old, it will just shift back to blacks and hispanics….
Ever notice that there are never any minority preachers, authors, politicians, spewing venom toward Muslims?
Just an observation….
I haven’t been “spewing venom” and nothing I’ve said can be classified as “hate” by a reasonable human being. My arguments have been nothing but logical and straight forward. This man killed his daughters because they didn’t adhear to his religion. Why is that so hard for you to understand, and why do you call me a bigot for calling it what it is? An honor killing…
JLG, my sincere apologies, if it seemed I was calling you specifically a bigot. My point was the idea, intention, etc. that makes one automatically want to blame an entire people or religion for the actions of a few, is in essence just that.
Whether direct or influenced, your rhetoric is in line with an industry that perpetuates the myth that all Muslims are…(insert slander).
My point was not to ignore the fact that this idiot killed because he believed that his religion said he should, but to highlight the fact that because he believed it, doesn’t mean that 1.5 billion share in his sentiments.
Furthermore, to totally ignore that “honor” killings is a cultural phenomenon in order to blame Islam is disingenuous at best and outright malicious at worst.
In that region of the world from Africa to India, “honor” killings happen and each individual blames their specific religion.
Therefore, if you want to say that Islam promotes “honor” killing because some say so, then you also have to blame the many other religions from African tribal religions, to Middle Eastern Christian sects, to Hinduism, and everything in between.
When I say devoid of reason I mean the lack and will of using a faculty of logic with the intended purpose to skew the facts and influence opinion.
If I say Islam is peaceful, because that is what I am and do based on my religion, the onus would be on me to prove that point. To do so, I site many verses from the Quran, Hadith, Islamic History, etc. as well as site raw numerical data that shows 95% or more Muslims do not engage in violence.
So if you want to paint “honor” killings as an Islamic thing, then the onus is on you to produce your proof if you are truthful.
Other than that, your just making an emotional statement based off of no real facts and that is to borrow a line from Spoc “Highly Illogical”
Robert Salaam, You make a very good, logical argument here, and i appreciate that more than your previous comment calling me “devoid of reason.” Thank you. I don’t disagree that there are people who feel that they have a lot to gain from causing panic about Islamic extremism (i.e. Tom Tancredo). “Industry” might be a bit strong though. Radicalism is becoming an increasing problem in the Islamic world though… even you would have to admit that. Where are the voices of the moderate Muslims who will denounce this behavior outright along with those who practice violent Islam? Instead they all seem to try to make us believe that Islam was not involved at all in any form… it was just “domestic violence,” or something like that. Why can’t moderate Islamic voices get honest about the problem radical Islam poses to the West? To reasonable people, it just looks like they’re trying to cover something up.
[...] is a language A few days ago I came across this post about an American muslim who killed his two teenage daughters, allegedly because they had [...]
[...] goes by the name “Shir Ha Shirim” participated in a spirited debate regarding one of my other posts on this topic, and he has now responded with a post of his own. In his response, [...]
JLG says:
“Where are the voices of the moderate Muslims who will denounce this behavior outright along with those who practice violent Islam? Instead they all seem to try to make us believe that Islam was not involved at all in any form… it was just “domestic violence,” or something like that. Why can’t moderate Islamic voices get honest about the problem radical Islam poses to the West? To reasonable people, it just looks like they’re trying to cover something up.”
I have heard this accusation a thousand times. This is why Muslims such as me are suspicious of people like you who are suspicious of me…ironic isn’t it. Just as easy as it is to flock to the myriad of anti-Islam sites to prove your points about how bad Islam is, it is just as easy to do the reverse, but many chose not to do it, and instead claim that they can’t hear the “moderate” voices. So I will help you out today.
You can start with http://www.theamericanmuslim.org then follow with my site http://www.theamericanmuslim.net between us two you will find thousand of links and resources maybe even hundreds of thousands of resources that prove that we are active right in plain site.
“Robert Salaam,” that’s another very suspicious tactic. Trying to turn the tables and act like the whole thing is my fault for asking questions. Why can’t you just call this what it is, an honor killing, and denounce it in all its forms?!
There is no excuse to be ignorant these days these days. Just google “Honor Killing” to find out thta it run across cultures and religions: Here is first hit:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2005/jun/23/israel
HONOR killing implies respect and adherence to GOD for HONOR for Islam, Christianity or other biblical purposes. But, before you do the next HONOR killing for your children or loved ones, please step back and ask yourself these 10 questions:
1. Have you observed the true teachings of HONOR of Islam, Christianity, or others and taught them well to your children? Then ask again, and review the teachings of Mohamed, the Prophet for Muslims, and Jesus, for Christians.
2. Have you taught them the love these great men and mentors brought to your faith?
3. Have you given your children enough love and knowledge to make them respect the teachings of your faith?
4. Have you kept close personal contact with your own children, family and friends and attended to their needs?
5. Have you consulted wise men and women (clerics, elders and friends) of your own faith – just as instructed by Mohamed and Jesus?
6. Have you thought about the shame and dishonor your action will bring to your other children, parents, family and friends? And the laws you will be violating?
7. Have you thought about corrective measures offered in the society you live in?
8. Have you thought about the disgrace your killing will bring to other persons and families in your community and worldwide?
9. Have you thought about yourself, and how you will continue on living with visions of your child dying in your arms?
10. Have you thought what GOD will do to you in case your killing is not justified? If GOD may not be happy with action, then you got yourself a double loss in life and the thereafter.
If the answer to any of these questions is MAYBE, then keep stepping back and correct yourself first before “correcting” others, especially your own children or loved ones. Point a finger to yourself first for blame and for dishonor before your point it to you own children and loved ones who need your love and guidance. Then reach to GOD for help and guidance to eliminate any MAYBE to the above answers.
“Someone who cares” said: “But, before you do the next HONOR killing for your children or loved ones, please step back and ask yourself these 10 questions…”
The fact that you believe that what I teach my children has any moral equivalence to a man killing his daughters negates everything else you said. That’s pure ignorance and depravity.
Salaam,
you are quite smooth with your brainless drivel…
racism?
no, if someone with a brain is not afraid of radical islam after 911, he is either himself a terrorist MUSLIM, or he has not heard of it (highly unlikely)
its incredibly stupid that you would say that this is just another form of racism, unless you want to call me a racist…
no, in fact it seems you are the racist here, as you cannot seem to let go of past sins…
and your name, is it the name of your family and ancestors, or did you radically claim this name (because it does not represent the oppression of the WHITE MAN) to make a statement?
BTW, if you want to go to heaven, check out CHRIST…i know you guys hold him in some honorable regard, but youre really missing out, because hes GOD
Jeremy came in here months after the fact to ensure we get to hear his “comments”.
Rather than re-argue the obvious know that my actions bear witness of me. Where have you served? What are you currently doing in the GWOT?
Lastly, your subtle Nation of Islam joke is just that a joke.
I changed my last name to Salaam to reflect my mission “Peace”.
I’m not part of the NOI.
Try again, and to your Christ (as) comment, judging by your commentary, I’m certain you couldn’t articulate your own scripture, as one who has studied and taught Christianity, I suggest you go re-read your book.